The value of a man's work

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Brian the brain
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Tue May 28, 2013 4:21 pm

Driving a car in the Netherlands is no fun at all
True.Hence the 125cc bobbed chopper moped thing.
lol that was just a joke.. plus I don't think they actually abuse the system at all... they are definitely more hard-working than native population
Not entirely correct.
The system abuses them by allowing us to pay them milkmoney for 70 hour weeks.

Employers gain , while society as a whole pays the bill.
Wages go down, unemployment rises, taking down the entire economy.
Jobs are not lost, they are taken, leaving one person unemployed for every one being hired-but under far worse conditions.

And who can blame anyone for wanting a bigger paycheck?
I would move to Poland if I could triple my salary! I might even take your job Polandspud!
I'd probably work harder too.
Not many of my countrymen can see what's going on.

Say you make a lot of money elswhere and then go back to your homeland.
Where will you be paying tax?You'll take money, earned in one country, and spend it in another.

Now multiply this effect by a few 100.000...

If Europe is one, wealth too will be redistributed :like pressure rushes into a cannon, from a storagetank as you open the valve seperating the two.
Afterwards, both cannon and tank are holding the same pressure.
Same thing with money and borders.

Now someone needs to kick that compressor!
MOAR PoWeR!...money I mean...For everyone.
Gun Freak wrote:
Oh my friggin god stop being so awesome, that thing is pure kick ass. Most innovative and creative pneumatic that the files have ever come by!

Can't ask for a better compliment!!
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POLAND_SPUD
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Tue May 28, 2013 6:36 pm

The system abuses them by allowing us to pay them milkmoney for 70 hour weeks.
But it's still more than what people earn here :-D


Obviously some of them spend money here in Poland and your country looses tax money it could potentially earn. But hey that's the price you have to pay for globalization and capitalism.


It's a double edged sword....
think of china - some think we're exploiting them - but the truth is that those who work in factories are AFAIK quite happy as they got a fairly decent (in comparison) pay

The only people who are exploited are workers in YOUR countries - because YOUR companies move to china. It's not the Chinese fault that you are fck### up your future for yourself thx to capitalism. Sadly I don't think there is any alternative to capitalism



Some might suggest more protectionism but let's be honest it just isn't possible any more. Besides you can't exploit other countries if they earn 1/5 of what people in your country earn - WTF are you going to sell them and how is that going to be cheaper than what they can produce ?
Children are the future

unless we stop them now
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jackssmirkingrevenge
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Wed May 29, 2013 12:26 am

POLAND_SPUD wrote:Besides you can't exploit other countries if they earn 1/5 of what people in your country earn - WTF are you going to sell them and how is that going to be cheaper than what they can produce ?
It's not necessarily about price, it could be sophisticated technology that said country could not achieve independently.
Brian the brain wrote:If Europe is one, wealth too will be redistributed :like pressure rushes into a cannon, from a storagetank as you open the valve seperating the two.
Afterwards, both cannon and tank are holding the same pressure.
Same thing with money and borders.
Men are getting tired of seeing their hard earned taxes going to support single mothers and immigrants, I don't think their spirit is broken enough to let this happen.
hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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POLAND_SPUD
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Wed May 29, 2013 7:50 am

Men are getting tired of seeing their hard earned taxes going to support single mothers and immigrants, I don't think their spirit is broken enough to let this happen.
You're naive - it is happening as we speak... and no one is going to do a damn thing.

It's not necessarily about price, it could be sophisticated technology that said country could not achieve independently.
I knew you'd point this out but it simply isn't the case any more.

The west is in decline. The immigrants, feminism and capitalism will ruin it.


I know it sounds crazy but it's a fact
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Children are the future

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jackssmirkingrevenge
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Wed May 29, 2013 8:02 am

POLAND_SPUD wrote:You're naive - it is happening as we speak... and no one is going to do a damn thing.
I hear you, and it is a possibility. Prod a lion enough times and it will bite your head off, but there is the possibility that it has been replaced by a fluffy kitten.
The west is in decline. The immigrants, feminism and capitalism will ruin it.


The next 100 years are going to be very interesting.
hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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Brian the brain
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Wed May 29, 2013 1:11 pm

A bit of a rant, but actually still on topic..
:D
Obviously some of them spend money here in Poland and your country looses tax money it could potentially earn. But hey that's the price you have to pay for globalization and capitalism.
I agree.
But our system works like this.
You pay tax over what you earn.You buy something,with that money and tax takes another 21% of the amount you paid.
The guy that sold it to you pays tax because he's made some money.
This goes on and on untill every euro is back in the treasurechest.

Some play the game better than other and earn more than they can spend in a lifetime.
They will pay tax over every euro they earn and spend, but also for the money they've got in the bank.
If they buy a house, they pay tax apon buying it, but also for owning it.Year after year.
Because that house has value.And our government deserves a piece of that value.

some people stay rich in spite of all that.
When a rich person dies..33% goes to tax.
They rest is inherited by their next of kin, who also pay tax over that amount untill they too die.
If they spend it,or earn more... see the above..

all of the money eventually returns into our economy.
some leaves for ever, some is invested back in.
This used to be relatively predictable.


Now imagine thousands of people leaving after this line:
You pay tax over what you earn.

We're not talking about a little bit of tax we're missing out on.
It's a part of our common wealth leaving.


But it's still more than what people earn here


That's my point.
I don't blame a single immigrant for coming here.
And I can't say I feel like poorer countries should stay that way just so we can stay wealthy.

I don't have the answers..I'm just observing.

I see smart, likable, hardworking Polish guys every day, but I also see their smirking bosses.

And sometimes I see the guys that used to work for those bosses.
I don't see many of them however.
Just the "lucky ones" that could find another job and are back for supplies.


It's just not right..


I'm just saying : politicians have underestimated the effect and are now wondering where our money's gone..
There is no back up plan or equaliser.

A carpenter that just lost his job doesn't need daycare for his kid.
In turn, a nanny, now without a job, is not going to buy that car at the moment.
A carsalesman dealing with a tough market is not going to throw his yearly party.
The DJ, that used to be well payed for showing up at parties just like that sees his income decline and decides he's not gonna have his roof done.

That single contract could have saved a struggling carpenter.
But now another carpenter is unemployed.

The effect of hiring cheap workers is only temporary if all your competitors do the same.

And Poland..I appreciate why this is so funny to you, but they're already looking for even cheaper workers from Asia to replace the current immigrants.
They'll earn as much here as your countrymen do at home.
Gun Freak wrote:
Oh my friggin god stop being so awesome, that thing is pure kick ass. Most innovative and creative pneumatic that the files have ever come by!

Can't ask for a better compliment!!
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POLAND_SPUD
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Wed May 29, 2013 3:51 pm

And Poland..I appreciate why this is so funny to you, but they're already looking for even cheaper workers from Asia to replace the current immigrants.
They'll earn as much here as your countrymen do at home.
But that is funny that rich countries are victims of their own success - simply because that's the way the things work

so if you pay asians even less it will ruin your economy even more
Children are the future

unless we stop them now
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mark.f
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Thu May 30, 2013 8:39 am

Your client is not smart enough to hand in a satisfactory paper. Capitalism provides a means of taking obscene amounts of money from suckers, and nobody is going to feel bad for somebody getting taken for a ride while cheating on his college coursework, with the sole exception of your wife apparently. No matter what the TV ads look like at times, no business model includes charity work. :wink:
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Fri May 31, 2013 12:30 am

mark.f wrote:No matter what the TV ads look like at times, no business model includes charity work. :wink:
Not necessarily true. There are a few business that make money off of charity. Hospitals that provide medical care to someone that can't pay can write off their "list" price for the service as a business loss. If the "list" price is high enough (even if nobody ever pays that list price) then it can offset enough profit to avoid paying taxes on the profit, which increases profit.
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Fri May 31, 2013 12:35 am

jackssmirkingrevenge wrote:Men are getting tired of seeing their hard earned taxes going to support single mothers and immigrants ...
Others realize that that doesn't amount to all that much money and instead are concerned about the trillions of dollars spent on wars that don't accomplish anything except kill and maim people and burn through huge piles of money, a large percentage of which is used to bribe foreign governments.
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jackssmirkingrevenge
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Fri May 31, 2013 12:38 am

jimmy101 wrote:Not necessarily true. There are a few business that make money off of charity. Hospitals that provide medical care to someone that can't pay can write off their "list" price for the service as a business loss. If the "list" price is high enough (even if nobody ever pays that list price) then it can offset enough profit to avoid paying taxes on the profit, which increases profit.
I supposed that is "charity" depending on the brackets you're willing to put it in. Looking at the wider picture, if the taxes were paid then there would be enough funds in public coffers for state funded healthc...

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I'm becoming a socialist! GET ME OUT OF EUROPE NOW AAAAAAAAUGHH!!!
Others realize that that doesn't amount to all that much money and instead are concerned about the trillions of dollars spent on wars that don't accomplish anything except kill and maim people and burn through huge piles of money, a large percentage of which is used to bribe foreign governments.
Very true, my comment was tongue in cheek ;) certainly your government is prone to waste in this department.
hectmarr wrote:You have to make many weapons, because this field is long and short life
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Fri May 31, 2013 5:54 pm

"I don't want to abolish government. I simply want to reduce it to the size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the bathtub."......Grover Norquist
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